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DMFLAG Self referencing sectors don't block shots

 
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Madgunner
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Joined: 23 Nov 2003
Location: Atlanta,GA

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 8:08 pm    Post subject: DMFLAG Self referencing sectors don't block shots Reply with quote

Hey, I'm copying this from one of SonicDoomMario's posts, but I can also vouch that this is a DMFLAG that ZDaemon needs. If you play map 15 on Alien Vendetta, there is a trap that raises bars around you. You are supposed to be able to shoot a switch behind the bars, but it is currently impossible to do that in ZDaemon, as your shots will get blocked by the bars. In a recent version of ZDoom a flag that alleviates this issue was added called "Self referencing sectors don't block shots." Perhaps this can be backported into ZDaemon?
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Cybershark
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Joined: 05 Jan 2005
Location: off the grid, but still fighting for the users!

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd agree that it'd be nice if this could be supported ...but I have only ever seen this one complaint about this behaviour in all my time here and however true to Doom2.exe this'd make things it seems ridiculous to add a whole new DMFLAG for just one map. It'd be easier just to patch the map wouldn't it?

I'm sure there are other levels out there which have a similar problem but would anybody ever find or play them?
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EarthQuake
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Joined: 02 Apr 2004
Location: Athens, Ohio. Dieblieber gonna getcha!

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I can tell, it's the map which is the problem here. The sector raises up too far so that the player can't shoot over it. It doesn't matter if it's self-referencing or not. You shouldn't be able to shoot through it, because that's not how broken sector effects like that behave. Does this map work correctly in Vanilla Doom? If so, why does it work in vanilla Doom and not ZDaemon? That's what we should be solving, not providing some workaround for another problem that exists.
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Madgunner
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Joined: 23 Nov 2003
Location: Atlanta,GA

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EarthQuake wrote:
From what I can tell, it's the map which is the problem here. The sector raises up too far so that the player can't shoot over it. It doesn't matter if it's self-referencing or not. You shouldn't be able to shoot through it, because that's not how broken sector effects like that behave. Does this map work correctly in Vanilla Doom? If so, why does it work in vanilla Doom and not ZDaemon? That's what we should be solving, not providing some workaround for another problem that exists.


I tested it with Chocolate Doom and you are able to shoot through the bars without issue. This is most likely a result of a change to the engine and not a problem with the map.
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Cybershark
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Joined: 05 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not familiar enough with the behaviour of such sectors in EXE to comment but I'll ask again: If it's only this one map that seems to have a problem with it then doesn't it make more sense to patch/skip the map rather than rewrite the engine?
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Madgunner
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Joined: 23 Nov 2003
Location: Atlanta,GA

PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 5:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cybershark wrote:
I'm not familiar enough with the behaviour of such sectors in EXE to comment but I'll ask again: If it's only this one map that seems to have a problem with it then doesn't it make more sense to patch/skip the map rather than rewrite the engine?


It's the only map off the top of my head that suffers from this issue, but its pretty safe to say that there are others which could be affected by this too.
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Kilgore
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Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: Up the river

PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you can shoot through that in exe, then I think Madgunner is right and we need a DMFLAG for such a change in engine behavior.

I tried checking it in AV but the map is huge and I can't find the given trap. Madgunner: can you please provide a simple test-map demonstrating the problem? it will speed things up quite a bit.
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Cybershark
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Joined: 05 Jan 2005
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 22, 2009 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Madgunner wrote:
It's the only map off the top of my head that suffers from this issue, but its pretty safe to say that there are others which could be affected by this too.

I said this above. But I also noted that this appears to be the only documented case, meaning the problem is on a very small scale.

Anyway, here's a demo map:
http://www.speedyshare.com/137850697.html

Actually it's the exact area from AV which I just amputated from the rest of the PWAD. Go for the Invisibility in there to set it all off.
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Kilgore
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Joined: 17 Jun 2003
Location: Up the river

PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2009 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thx a lot for the map Cybershark and for all the help and efforts Madgunner. It's verified, already implemented and should appear on the next public release. Check the changelog.
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