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dewww
God like!


Joined: 29 Dec 2006

PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2010 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thadeuss wrote:
I was so sickened by people's reaction to me during that tournament that I pretty much left ZD (I've only played twice in about 5 months).

I think if people with more no-how, better ability to run tournaments, and people who hold more respect than me amongst the players resurrected the idea of doing some massive clan tournaments, then it could be a great success.

ok, this is my cue. i am sorry for treating you so badly. you've done a great job of inventing the whole new tourney format and organizing it multiple times. it was superb fun while it lasted and you can't be thanked enough for that. i'm sure i couldn't have thought it out better even if i stole all your ideas and tried to improve.

but you've done a poor job when it came to the ugly part of admin duties and you should've stepped on someone's balls during the v3 finale. you tried to be correct and diplomatic, finding neutral grounds and that was good - for the first time. but.. this. i admire you for trying to be a good person through all the shit that happened, but in the end you kept dodging tough decisions that required a strong stance for too long. of course the final feud was what spilled the cup. you should've forfeited D's games, because they utterly failed in scheduling them, NOT giving them favour after favour just because they seemed like a contender when the tourney started. OR you should've disqualified CI for challenging your decisions furiously. that'd probably create drama of epic proportions, but at least you'd have shown there's some balls flapping under that skirt of yours.

i apologize for being the one who summoned the shitstorms again and again, but your admin team clearly lacked someone who'd kick ass when necessary. also mortal was a ridiculously poor choice. did he do anything other than vote in D's favour in the admin decisions? there's no people with more 'no-how' and you have all the respect and abilities needed. to put it completely blunt - you just don't intimidate people enough. when D laughed at you, you laughed with them. i consider you an awesome, multi-talented person, so believe me i felt really bad for pointing it out for you in such a crude way. please come back.

this might seem completely unrelated to this thread, so to correct it.. vendetta 3 drama also killed euro ctf. I> was a positive surprise with their performance and they might have stirred some activity, but they disbanded soon after. D realized they don't stand a chance against the full power of matured CI and ran in shame. UBR died, LM had still a long transition time to become BK again, NK and dp dwell in shadows. so every clan knew it's place and there was 'no need' for challenges. D cannibalized the best of I> now, basically recreating CHAOS, but they are the ones who should issue a proper challenge to CI. we are on the mountain top and ready to prove our superiority. and no, master-style scrims that become clanwars/challenges when his team wins don't count. :)
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NoStar
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Joined: 08 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't remember any of this really. Here is a newer player's perspective.

DX killed the clan scene mostly. It would have been less drastic but all the UD players worth a shit were banned or named Humanbones. I came around after most of that happened so I can really only tell you why doom is not being played now. Zdaemon was popular because it was relatively free, fast paced game and offered a low spec fun fps to an audience who grew up on doom/doom2. The current generation of guys MIGHT remember when counterstrike came out. Probably not though. We're pretty much at the Halo generation and that just isn't good for a translatable skill level [Halo blows]. Additionally, ambassadors for our little "niche community" haven't stuck around at all. DUI guys....gone....UD guys....banned....DX guys....assholes. SIN? HC? NS? GONE or in IDL!

So what you have is the runoff from past days playing in a league where doom is still kind of fun. I'm actually quite flattered that someone called IDL sportscenter. I really like sportscenter and that's a compliment to me. If only there were enough people playing and active to make IDL as interesting as pro sports people wouldn't make "doom is dying" threads.

I'd also like to make a comment about the "exclusivity" of IDL. Contrary to what you guys think IDL was an exclusive thing to start, which I don't really think is a bad thing. It was exclusive in the same way clans are exclusive (theoretically). You want players of similar skill and similar ideas about why doom is fun (and if you buy into that clan=family stuff then similar ideas about lots of things). I started about...3 years ago and people thought from the very beginning that I was a cheater or an alias and it was VERY hard to get any kind of foot hold to stick around in the competitive circles of ZDaemon. It is less hard in ST for sure which is why they are more active than ZD is. Basically if you're new and not RobertK-bad you'll be recruited into OP or R or whatever gay clans they have in less than 5 minutes. Skulltag is very inclusive because they have lower standards than IDL or the Ol' Days of ZDaemon. Hell I'm not even sure you can call them standards. It certainly promotes playing, but not anything I want to be a part of.

Personally I think the community is in decline, not because of a lack of drama but because there used to be players who were smart, active and skilled (often collegiate) who have moved on the last 3-6 years. I mean once you graduate (or at this point go off to) college doom isn't really a priority. And it shouldn't be. But back before Badfish was king and Hijango was a crapass people were playing off of kickass college connections and raping. Those are the golden days you guys are talking about. People in college are playing WoW or Bad Company or CoD or whatever. Not doom.

What I'm getting at is that it's a social shift in how players come into ZDaemon. The player base has gotten younger and less integrated because they are younger and the old guys, devs included, don't bring them into the fold at all. Basically the only times I ever see a dev say anything in Zdplayers is to chastise someone for having a question or a (usually retarded) opinion. This is mostly Raider though, I only ever see him and Kilgore saying anything. IDL has sort of poached most of the good active players in ZDaemon anyway.

On the topic of development and how that all goes, it's mostly clandestine. You can work on bugs, you can submit stuff based on 1.06 and try to work your way into the current developer's good graces. Most people worth their salt at any kind of coding just don't bother. Ladna has done a lot of really cool things with managing the software, zserv management and stats calculation + web interfaces. A lot of database work to make players more honest with aliases in a league format and demo archival on top of that. The weird thing is that all of this costs money and takes time and skill. I would imagine that ZDaemon development takes similar resources and Lyfe, Danni and Kilgore should be given their due for that. Unfortunately there really isn't too much in the way of letting newer and more motivated programmers in. ZDaemon offers so little in gratification that no one really wants to work on it that isn't already seriously invested.

Oh, and unbanning Ralph won't make ZDaemon more appealing. It might make players stick around longer if the ONLY competitive CTF league were advertised but Ralphis isn't like some banned Aphrodite. I do think it would benefit both IDL and ZDaemon to unban ralph. Raider disagrees and it's up to him. So far as I'm concerned I've voiced my opinion and the ball is in his court. To my knowledge a lot of people have done the same and the end result is a very irrational and unflinching no. The world hates autocrats ye they exist, it's a mystery. My point is that the mainstream ZDaemon community isn't really less active as a result of Ralph's ban. It's less fun though, but it's less fun without Chain and Chow and Bones and Romeo and blah blah blah. Personalities are why ZD used to be more appealing and they're just less invested now. Ralph is a personality, and an interesting one at that.

Aside from the drama, ZD is in decline because it's old and it's player base is growing up. Hell I started basically after DX quit and I'm pretty much done now. People who played Zdaemon when there were teenagers are 20+ and people who were teenagers when doom came out are...30+. Doom is older than the Jacksonville Jaguars. You gotta expect some attrition.

While I'm at it, Switcher, ccarnage. You guys never play. I, in my 3 years of fairly active playing, just saw switcher in server under his real name for the first time last week. I have no idea why you guys are even an authority. From what I hear neither of you were ever that good and most of the greats from your era are great in this one too. I played badfish back in April and he still rocked Dweller. Chewy won IDL 3 times, JKist twice, and Dev has been raping ZDDL since it started. Stop preaching your archaic nonsense and step aside or get better. I suggest joining IDL or ZDDL to compete. If you're really that tied OS join ECL Smile

I would say that the way to get the community active again is to start clan based leagues inside of ZDaemon. IDL is great but none of the top players want to play with Psar or s--p so having a more ZDaemon sponsored league might net more activity than the meager poaching we do for IDL. Let's see some people step up and make this happen. LB and Quik took over tourneys maybe they can get smth going.

Also mieksux and is a transvert.
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Masta
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Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Location: France Ch'ti Clan: [D]

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yea ok dew
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Dopefish
Dominating!


Joined: 18 Aug 2006
Location: From the shadows I come!

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

NoStar wrote:
I don't remember any of this really. Here is a newer player's perspective.

DX killed the clan scene mostly. It would have been less drastic but all the UD players worth a shit were banned or named Humanbones. I came around after most of that happened so I can really only tell you why doom is not being played now. Zdaemon was popular because it was relatively free, fast paced game and offered a low spec fun fps to an audience who grew up on doom/doom2. The current generation of guys MIGHT remember when counterstrike came out. Probably not though. We're pretty much at the Halo generation and that just isn't good for a translatable skill level [Halo blows]. Additionally, ambassadors for our little "niche community" haven't stuck around at all. DUI guys....gone....UD guys....banned....DX guys....assholes. SIN? HC? NS? GONE or in IDL!

So what you have is the runoff from past days playing in a league where doom is still kind of fun. I'm actually quite flattered that someone called IDL sportscenter. I really like sportscenter and that's a compliment to me. If only there were enough people playing and active to make IDL as interesting as pro sports people wouldn't make "doom is dying" threads.

I'd also like to make a comment about the "exclusivity" of IDL. Contrary to what you guys think IDL was an exclusive thing to start, which I don't really think is a bad thing. It was exclusive in the same way clans are exclusive (theoretically). You want players of similar skill and similar ideas about why doom is fun (and if you buy into that clan=family stuff then similar ideas about lots of things). I started about...3 years ago and people thought from the very beginning that I was a cheater or an alias and it was VERY hard to get any kind of foot hold to stick around in the competitive circles of ZDaemon. It is less hard in ST for sure which is why they are more active than ZD is. Basically if you're new and not RobertK-bad you'll be recruited into OP or R or whatever gay clans they have in less than 5 minutes. Skulltag is very inclusive because they have lower standards than IDL or the Ol' Days of ZDaemon. Hell I'm not even sure you can call them standards. It certainly promotes playing, but not anything I want to be a part of.

Personally I think the community is in decline, not because of a lack of drama but because there used to be players who were smart, active and skilled (often collegiate) who have moved on the last 3-6 years. I mean once you graduate (or at this point go off to) college doom isn't really a priority. And it shouldn't be. But back before Badfish was king and Hijango was a crapass people were playing off of kickass college connections and raping. Those are the golden days you guys are talking about. People in college are playing WoW or Bad Company or CoD or whatever. Not doom.

What I'm getting at is that it's a social shift in how players come into ZDaemon. The player base has gotten younger and less integrated because they are younger and the old guys, devs included, don't bring them into the fold at all. Basically the only times I ever see a dev say anything in Zdplayers is to chastise someone for having a question or a (usually retarded) opinion. This is mostly Raider though, I only ever see him and Kilgore saying anything. IDL has sort of poached most of the good active players in ZDaemon anyway.

On the topic of development and how that all goes, it's mostly clandestine. You can work on bugs, you can submit stuff based on 1.06 and try to work your way into the current developer's good graces. Most people worth their salt at any kind of coding just don't bother. Ladna has done a lot of really cool things with managing the software, zserv management and stats calculation + web interfaces. A lot of database work to make players more honest with aliases in a league format and demo archival on top of that. The weird thing is that all of this costs money and takes time and skill. I would imagine that ZDaemon development takes similar resources and Lyfe, Danni and Kilgore should be given their due for that. Unfortunately there really isn't too much in the way of letting newer and more motivated programmers in. ZDaemon offers so little in gratification that no one really wants to work on it that isn't already seriously invested.

Oh, and unbanning Ralph won't make ZDaemon more appealing. It might make players stick around longer if the ONLY competitive CTF league were advertised but Ralphis isn't like some banned Aphrodite. I do think it would benefit both IDL and ZDaemon to unban ralph. Raider disagrees and it's up to him. So far as I'm concerned I've voiced my opinion and the ball is in his court. To my knowledge a lot of people have done the same and the end result is a very irrational and unflinching no. The world hates autocrats ye they exist, it's a mystery. My point is that the mainstream ZDaemon community isn't really less active as a result of Ralph's ban. It's less fun though, but it's less fun without Chain and Chow and Bones and Romeo and blah blah blah. Personalities are why ZD used to be more appealing and they're just less invested now. Ralph is a personality, and an interesting one at that.

Aside from the drama, ZD is in decline because it's old and it's player base is growing up. Hell I started basically after DX quit and I'm pretty much done now. People who played Zdaemon when there were teenagers are 20+ and people who were teenagers when doom came out are...30+. Doom is older than the Jacksonville Jaguars. You gotta expect some attrition.

While I'm at it, Switcher, ccarnage. You guys never play. I, in my 3 years of fairly active playing, just saw switcher in server under his real name for the first time last week. I have no idea why you guys are even an authority. From what I hear neither of you were ever that good and most of the greats from your era are great in this one too. I played badfish back in April and he still rocked Dweller. Chewy won IDL 3 times, JKist twice, and Dev has been raping ZDDL since it started. Stop preaching your archaic nonsense and step aside or get better. I suggest joining IDL or ZDDL to compete. If you're really that tied OS join ECL Smile

I would say that the way to get the community active again is to start clan based leagues inside of ZDaemon. IDL is great but none of the top players want to play with Psar or s--p so having a more ZDaemon sponsored league might net more activity than the meager poaching we do for IDL. Let's see some people step up and make this happen. LB and Quik took over tourneys maybe they can get smth going.

Also mieksux and is a transvert.


tl;dr , next please
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NoStar
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Joined: 08 Nov 2007

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dopefish wrote:

tl;dr , next please


It's shorter than the post that started this thread. Though I guess it is a little long for someone that never got past picture books. Always a pleasure dope!
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Masta
Unstoppable!


Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Location: France Ch'ti Clan: [D]

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 1:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I should return to the past dewww, it would make me say things useless, because D & Chaos has ample potential to beat anyone you want here.
The only difference with you is that we find a lot to play at a time, but we were the [Chaos] gay.
Again, you never ceased to light the fuse with some of your comrades in the forums thread. And that having done all this, there have had less of respect to everyone. And you even managed to be against Thadeuss... This explains your whole mindset of the community. There are more challenges that we had at "one time". remains just provocative, nothing more.

About I>, I managed to prove to you all that I can do good things with a team that was not initially "favorites". and if I leave I>, was for the simple reason for a second time, that we no longer challenge without hear "fuck off I> master," you do not meet our capabilities. Our team. That said, be back with my former teammate or not, it would change anything in the future. But I was happy to play with these former teammate I> ! Don't worry.

So now, please... Keep your apologies for you, the damage is done, you would not change anything.

About Mortalogy, whatever you can say about him, it bothers you, just because he was always better than you.


Finally, continue to think that you are the best.
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Ladna
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Joined: 26 Jul 2008

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

IDL was rather exclusive from the start, but this is no longer the case. To be clear:

The IDL encourages everybody to point their IRC clients to quakenet.org, #idl! Play Private CTF! Join IDL teams!

Seriously the one thing IDL wants more than anything are players that are willing to show up, improve, and above all compete. We really, really hate the idea that there are players who would like to play in IDL but don't/can't for various reasons. Admittedly we're to blame for some of that (only 8 teams, etc.), but trust me when I say if we get enough player interest, we will absolutely expand to accommodate as many players as possible. JOIN IDL!

=============================================

Here's some server addresses in case you want to add them to your launcher:

66.225.231.106:11014 - Private CTF
66.225.231.106:11022 - IDL Server A
66.225.231.106:11023 - IDL Server B
66.225.231.106:11024 - IDL Server C
66.225.231.106:11025 - IDL Server D

The Private CTF password is "colombo", and the IDL passwords are "seasoneight".

PLEASE do not just join a team and start playing! These aren't run like normal public servers. Join either the green or white team until you figure out what is going on; when in doubt, ask in #idl!
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DevastatioN
God like!


Joined: 31 Jul 2002
Location: Nova Scotia

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alright, holy shit, where do I start, uh... Hello my name is DevastatioN, you may have seen me around a tiny bit the last... 10 years...

Ok I won't even pretend to have read every post here in full, cause you know I didn't.

About unbanning people, as much as some bans were well deserved.. I have to admit that after a good 5 years it may be enough to give someone some more chances (unless they were cheaters, they can rot forever). At this stage in ZDaemon I think just having some more players is a good idea. If players act out against staff I would say just remove them from IRC and at least still let them play on servers. As previously said, I dunno if it actually does much good, the decision is up to Raider/Kilgore/Staff, and I imagine they'll make a decision they can live with.

The old badasses, and drama, and assholes, and etc. all made the game exciting for many people. I think the real breakdown started when things starting going players vs staff, and people got banned. I'm not faulting the staff or the players, but maybe this whole thing can be analyzed and maybe there is some future procedure that can change to lighten this up.

In the old days, if someone screwed with me and they started it, I would follow them around, harrass them, frag them, maybe namefake similar to them, you know... have some fun! Players took advantage of this and obviously bans had to be enforced strictly (who wants to go through who started what like it was a playground?). So maybe there are some practices that can be loosened, and still not have the community erupt in chaos.

Now for some real ways to improve the community. As much as I love 1on1, new players don't... even in Quakelive I can't find very many skilled 1v1 players nowadays at my level, most have given up and the games are slowing down. Clan Arena, FFA, and CTF are still big. CTF seems pretty big in ZD still. But what about FFA?

As much whining as Dwango5 FFA used to get, the thing was LOADED. I miss the good old days of playing D5 FFA that's for sure. I think we should try and promote FFA more, new players enjoy FFA esp on maps they are familliar with. They also don't get roasted like they will in CTF and 1v1.

The next two things are the biggest imo.

1. How do we advertise doom is still played? How DO we get our new players? I mean, I dragged some over from Quake... and sure all of our friends hear about the countless hours we play and follow our tournaments... but where the hell do our new players come from? The older doom gets, the more no one knows about it. I think we need to figure out how to get the name out there more for those who like classics.

2. When new players come, and are called noobs, and harrassed... they leave. I've always tried to help anyone I've found in a game who clearly use a few tips, and I've tried creating a bunch of training material. ZDaemon has some good CTF guides and stuff too, but how well are these promoted? How easy are they to find for players who really look for them? I think we should look into how we treat our new players. We need to help them along, even if the ZD installer has a "new to doom playing? maybe read these helpful tips to improve your knowledge of the game!".

Now finally, tournaments. We have monthly tournaments sometimes, we have ZDDL, and we have IDL. Europe has other things. Thad was on the right track with his tournament for sure, we need to get people playing who are here, get people off IRC and into the servers.

I imagine most of this is uncoordinated, and is ramblings, but those are my current thoughts on some situations which could help the community overall and improve the numbers potentially. At least create the atmosphere where we CAN strive again.


Last edited by DevastatioN on Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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Masta
Unstoppable!


Joined: 02 Mar 2009
Location: France Ch'ti Clan: [D]

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 2:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wanted to play with that before, but that was already started. let me try on the next.
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Quiksilver
Spamming!


Joined: 02 Dec 2004
Location: Portlandia, Oregon

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about everytime a server is entered that previously had no players in the server, IRC would announce in the #ZDPlayers channel (or #ZDaemon, or whatever) that servers address, Iwad, Pwad, and Game mode.

People sitting in IRC would be like "yea, that sounds fun".


Is this even a possible implementation?
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SuperNova
Unstoppable!


Joined: 12 May 2008
Location: Toledo, OH, Clan: >AC<

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Man, look at what I've started. I'm great.

Okay guys, some really really good feedback. Props to Nostar and Dev for what some consider "tl;dr(aka have the attention span of a goldfish)."

There are a few things I'd like to clarify from my original post. As I've read these responses, I've realized I was really dull on some key points and could have focused on those some more. So here goes:

The biggest two things I've seen really expressed thus far have been Ralphis' ban and the IDL/Clan scene dilemma.

1) Ralphis' ban: Most newer people don't really know the true meaning behind this and what really happened. Honestly, the only people who know what truly happened are the people involved so in no way will I go into that. What I will say, albeit re-emphasize what I stated earlier, is that Ralphis is a key personality in this community. He has been the driving force and the original creator of the most successful league in the history of DooM. To all of you people who want to separate that, not just ZDaemon but anything DooM or related to it thereof. It is my honest opinion that after 5 years (and keep in mind, Ralphis is the same age as me, 22. Thus, he was banned when he was 17. We were all kind of loopy at 17) whatever happened can be resolved. He is the best promoter for IDL, whether you like him or not. He has ideas like any great has, but unlike most of them, he is willing to put the work into them and accomplish it to the best of it's potential. I know it's a sensitive issue and I know that it really gets the blood boiling in a lot of people, but what I'm asking for is to finally put an end to this and let bygones be bygones with no impact other than a positive one. If Ralph comes back, I'm quite positive he isn't going to try to take over ZDaemon or advertise Odamex publicly. I'm pretty sure all Ralph would want to do is to publicly advertise the IDL on ZDaemon and expand the playing field so noobs and vets could play alike. So with that being said, I'll put an end to that portion and move on to my next.

The IDL.

As I've read this thread over and over, I've thought a lot about the Clan scene suffering from the IDL. Because of the IDL, more players have improved in the mode of CTF as a whole because all of the best players are no longer in one clan. I've been a member of this community for 7 years, and in 2007 I was one of the top players in the world in 1vs1, but I still couldn't compete at the highest of levels in CTF. Now, in the ending saga of my career, I've improved and have finally developed the ability to be versatile and compete in any position at the IDL level. I suspect it is because I played along side players who were much better than me in that mode who could educate me on it, give me tips and make me work my butt off to keep up. Clan play cannot do that as most people are scared and will do one of two things:

1) Join the most dominant clan if offered a position. It's not like pro sports, you're not getting money for this. This shows you how afraid people are to lose, they don't want to risk the embarrassment of it, so they'll join the top clans rather than forming their own and developing their players. That's why Deception and I created Astroclan. No, it could not compete with the likes of UD and DX, but I noticed from when we first started playing against guys in like that, we improved toward the end. This is also evident in public CTF when people will join the winning team, even if it makes the team amounts unbalanced in numbers and skill. Bottom line, people are afraid. Clans tie directly to those people and represent them, so they go to the winning one or...

2) They will form or join a lesser tier clan and refuse to play good ones. Based on what I said in exhibit one, this is self-explanatory. This is why dominant clans can be really bad for the scene. One dominant clan discourages the cowards and beats down on the brave ones. It's an extraordinary display of skill but it usually results in those brave ones breaking up, thus killing the clan scene.

Unfortunately, to an extent, the same holds true in the IDL but it's not nearly as bad. You will typically play with a lot of high level players so you're going in with a bit more confidence. Also, teams change from season to season, so even if you're on a losing team, the terms there's always next season literally comes to life here. So the emotional tie as well as the fear of losing to someone else isn't nearly as strong. But since the game is played at such a high level and the skill constantly swipes back and forth from team to team, from player-to-player, it will, in my opinion, help develop everyone faster as awhole on a public level (if it was applied).

I believe clans are dead in ZDaemon and the future of it are in leagues. The IDL and ZDDL are the big-times and do you think it's any coincidence that when these two leagues began, clans began to die? 1vs1 has been dying but I wouldn't say it's a world-wide phenomenon. From what I see, the duel scene in Europe has really gotten better, as opposed to what it was about 3 years ago, which was pretty much non-existent.

So since competitive leagues are the future of ZDaemon, it is my belief that we should begin investing in them as much as we can, however we can. Yes, they will continue to be ran on separate databases, but if we could somehow tie that into ZDaemon, then I think this could help shift this era of ZDaemon into it's next golden era.

As far as advertising goes, in some ways, that will take care of itself. Whiteboy pointed out that when DooM3 came out, DooM2 drew a lot of interest and when you think about it, he was right. When DooM4 comes out, it will probably do the same again. If we want to be serious about advertising for this, spreading the word amongst people is the best way. Post it on your social networks, tell your friends about it, if you're active in other gaming communities, mention it. None of this can hurt. But that's been pretty much covered so there's no need to go into any further detail.

I think that pretty much covers it though.

P.S Also, anyone who says tl;dr, you need to develop a much better attention span. This is some serious discussin', so naturally there will be long, thought-out posts as opposed to brainless, moronic posts such as "lol u wrong dewd i right hehetehe." Get it together, son.
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switcher
Spamming!


Joined: 26 Jun 2004
Location: DUI All The Way

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just want to point out that although I stopped using my [DUI]Switcher-t nick for a long time, because of all the hassles it brought, I never stopped playing this game on a regular basis.
As many of my friends here know, I've using an assortment of nicks over the years that many of you would easily recognize.
So don't assume that because you haven't seen the Switcher nick that I haven't been here.


And to all of you who think ZDaemon is CTF, please explain to me...
how is it that the standard of qualifying a player's skill for admission into a clan is and always has been to have him play a 1 on 1 with someone in the clan?
Just like in the old days, clan members gather up in a server, shoot the shit, and watch the new applicant getting put through his paces.

Anyway, I've been back to using Switcher since running into another [DUI] member recently, and I intend to continue to do so.
So come on out and razz.

I won't dignify the other cat calls from the peanut gallery with a response.
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soncdoommario
Unstoppable!


Joined: 19 Jun 2004
Location: Attleboro, Massachusetts

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

haha, I miss the GSN #3 Dwango5 days too, switch and Dev.

It was pathetic. We all knew each other. We all knew where everybody camped. I remember me and my cousin (And128) would fire up the server each morning, and before you knew it, the server was loaded. It didn't take long afterthat for the server to be up all day, everyday.

I think I even remember 14 straight hours of Dwango5 one night.

And solely because of Dwango5, 2004 was an awesome summer.
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Solar_Flare
On a Rampage!


Joined: 01 Jun 2009

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 5:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, in retrospect, the one thing I remember the most from when I first joined is that it was a LOT easier to find 1v1 games. Generally I could refresh and someone was playing or a server was half full. Not only that, back then I was in CD and we played a whole lot of 1v1's and CTF, because we loved to play. I can remember being in a 1v1 server for hours talking and watching other play, good stuff. But now that I think about it, I think that banning people actually drives other people away indirectly. For example, the two people I knew from the very start when I first started playing, Relapse and DemonSphere, they are the ones I still talk to every now and then since the clan had died. Personally, I don't think Demon ever cheated, he was just way better than me and had more years of experience but we always gave each other good games. It just so happened he was insanely good with the railgun, and because he was not well known and because he was better than even those who thought they were all godly, he was banned with no real evidence. Relapse was banned for political reasons I'm not getting into but, in any case, since their bans, it had become harder to play 1v1's with people I enjoyed playing with. If it weren't for IDL and ZDDL, I probably would have just stopped playing as soon as the last person I really enjoyed playing with and against got banned since there would be no real reason too anymore, I wouldn't have gotten joy out of playing by myself. Just certain bans can kill part of the community, I imagine how it would be if half of the banlist was gone(not including cheaters who were caught cheating, they can stay) It would most likely be more lively around here.
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Ladna
Posting Spree!


Joined: 26 Jul 2008

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quiksilver wrote:
What about everytime a server is entered that previously had no players in the server, IRC would announce in the #ZDPlayers channel (or #ZDaemon, or whatever) that servers address, Iwad, Pwad, and Game mode.

People sitting in IRC would be like "yea, that sounds fun".


Is this even a possible implementation?


Yeah, if ZDIRC would allow other bots, ZDStack could do it with plugins quite easily. But odds of that happening are zilch.
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ccarnage
God like!


Joined: 14 Jan 2003
Location: That place wit all de hot girls

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
From what I hear neither of you were ever that good and most of the greats from your era


When I was at my peak I was beating the likes of Sedlo etc in the Euro servers. And certainly holding my own in the USA GSN/Fnord servers, hence why I was the only European member of strong US clans such as 138, NG, -=Vile=-...in fact I was even a hired gun for UD for 2 days so that they could win a clan war . From what I gather Jkist3 is winning a lot now, but I wasn't too far behind him with Euro ping on US servers. However, I agree with your point that the best players now were pretty awesome back in the day. The newer crop of Euro players seem extremely strong, whereas in my day there were fewer great Euro players.

I haven't played a proper zdaemon game since 2005, due to real life i.e. university, now a job etc. But the few times I have logged in, I see very limited activity in the 1on1 servers. EDL and ZDDL were awesome ideas, and implemented to perfection, has there been a second season of EDL or ZDDL? Reading this thread certainly makes me want to play again Laughing
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SuperNova
Unstoppable!


Joined: 12 May 2008
Location: Toledo, OH, Clan: >AC<

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In regards to your comments about keeping up with with JKist3 on American soil, I can tell you as a player who was coming into his own around that time, the JKist3 of now would completely trounce the JKist3 of then. Keeping up with Sedlo is impressive and all but to be honest, using Sedlo as a gauge for skill isn't exactly poetic. The guy just plays non-stop and doesn't really care much if he loses. Perhaps he did then but I would be willing to assume Sedlo would rock you if he actually cared enough to slow down. It's not a matter of disrespecting you because from what I've seen, you were definitely the cream of the crop in Euro 1vs1 back then. But yeah I've played Sedlo while taking it seriously as well as seen him do it and as noted above, when he does that, he'd wreck about 99% of this community, including you. And even further more, I must ask because players do this all the time:

So hey yeah, dude I beat Sedlo back in the day. Yeah? How many times did you guys play? Ugh, probably about 100 times. Yeah? Yeah. How many times did you win? Twice. Ah, yeah way to keep up with him, champ.

Not saying that's how it was but I tend to see a lot of players do that.

Anyway, the one thing I always try to avoid is comparing eras to each other. Circumstances of generations are so different that they aren't really worth comparing as there's no true way to determine it unless they decide to play. Even then, if you came back out of retirement and practiced for a month straight, I'm still sure I'd have no problem beating you because after 5 years, you've lost a step and will probably never regain it. Take it from me, I've never regained my full abilities I had in 2007 in regards to how accurate I was and probably never will. But with that being said, I've also improved in some areas that at one time I thought I had peaked out in. So yeah, it's really hard to say because too many things change in between those times to compare those eras.

Sniper is my man, but I think that comment was a bit uncalled for. Even still snipe, I love the aggression. I know you like to talk big game, Shy and I applaud you for caring enough to still come in here and run your mouth occasionally, because quite frankly, we don't have enough of that. That's why I love Star. He's a fucking self-absorbed, shit talking arrogant prick - I love it. In 1vs1, he doesn't quite fit the bill, but in CTF, he usually backs that shit the FUCK up. So yeah, I'd love to see more shit-talking, it's fun.
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DeVilS
has entered the game!


Joined: 06 Jan 2010
Location: France

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 12:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dewww : we are on the mountain top and ready to prove our superiority. and no, master-style scrims that become clanwars/challenges when his team wins don't count. Smile

wait and see simply.

1: - take your best team (THE BEST OF GOD)
- we take our best team (D of shit)

2 : CLANWARS official soon

3 : GL
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HumanBones
Boner!


Joined: 01 Jun 2004
Location: Shangri-La Dee Da

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would it be nice to have people unbanned? Sure, some of them I guess. Many of my clanmates were banned, and truthfully most of them deserved it. It's not my decision to unban people, so I'm just going to respect whatever decisions do get made.

After 7 years, I still have grudges with people that are stupid and petty, but grudges nonetheless. So honestly, I won't question anything.

I haven't played in a real clan war in years. I haven't even competitively played 1v1 in several years. Some of this is attributed to many large personalities being banned, and some of it is just disappearing. Nobody sticks around forever. But the fact is that this community has split in two. I stopped playing when all my friends were either banned or left. So did all the really skilled players, they all migrated to the IDL. The skill level on public servers has been stagnant for years. That led to fewer clans, fewer wars, fewer tournaments..

I'll admit the tournament situation is partly my fault. I've had one hell of a time trying to get enough people interested in tournaments. I mean, I had to go into #idl and pretty much beg people to sign up, hoping it would spark something. I'm at a loss really.

ZDaemon still gets plenty of new players every single day, but they don't stick around. It's really quite sad, but its an easy fix if you ask me. We just have to get this community going again. We have to get people interested in tournaments, we have to revive the clan scene, and even mappers (decent ones anyway) are difficult to find these days. I haven't been around much lately, and I'm not the most reliable person, but I've been trying for years to get things going again.

The only thing I can say that has worked is ZDS, and for the past year+ its been all Cybershark and TheCupboard (and our regulars!) Now, to what seems to be a touchy subject, making the IDL public would be a great way to kickstart the community again. That's where all the great players of today are found. Coincidentally, these players were also the greats of yesterday. So you can really see how stagnant things have become.

Going back to the bans..I'd like to think that a lot of people are more mature now, and would be able to handle being allowed back in. It's still not my call, but I'm a hopeful kindaaaa guy. I could also be horribly wrong, so who knows.
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BAZOOKA
Unstoppable!


Joined: 10 Feb 2004

PostPosted: Sun Jul 25, 2010 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nostalgia effect. It happens.

DevastatioN wrote:

As much whining as Dwango5 FFA used to get, the thing was LOADED. I miss the good old days of playing D5 FFA that's for sure. I think we should try and promote FFA more, new players enjoy FFA esp on maps they are familliar with. They also don't get roasted like they will in CTF and 1v1.

FFA has been dying slowly since 3'5-3 years aproximately, mainly because the old and obsolete exp system is still running. The number of wads played has been decreasing due to that too.
Also most of the servers have bots in.
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